Holiness to the LORD and his wife

Would this be a troublesome phrase for LDS to put on their temples?  If so, why?

Secondly, BRoz shares more of the LDS perspective on Psalm 82.

Are goddesses to be recognized in the LDS High Council?

C.S. Lewis shows pictures of high kings and queens.  How come I have never seen a picture of an LDS goddess sitting by an LDS god on a throne in an LDS picture book?


  1. All of this is due to a sacred respect toward and for the Devine Feminine.

    Have you not read the admonition:
    Matt. 7: 6
    “Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.”

    Thus we do not take that which is most precious to us and pin it upon our sleeves, nor do we expect our Heavenly Father to do this with our Heavenly Mother.

    (on a side note some may think this idea offensive, that we have a mother in heaven as well as a Father.)

    Hope this answers your question,

  2. According to the Book of Mormon, there is one God. Therefore obviously, Father and Mother is “One God.”

    Why would you want to make it plural?

  3. This whole discussion (this post and the previous one) is really out there. When and if Heavenly Father decides to reveal more on this subject is when we’ll learn more about it. Until then we’ll stick to the doctrines that He has revealed. It is not up to us to decide when to receive new doctrine or information.

  4. First, does the LDS heavenly Father not even speak of his “pearl” to LDS authorities? I don’t think he does. Strange. Maybe he speaks more clearly to those outside the Church. (The only problem is that those outside the Church are hearing of this male/female love relationship as not quite a marriage. Hmmmm.)

    Secondly, if LDS men are to be like their LDS Heavenly Father, then how come they don’t become like him in this way with their wives – not speaking about them at all? Obviously, I don’t think they would want to be like him in this way. That would be shameful.

    Thirdly, isn’t it interesting what pattern the God of Glory does give in the Bible for husbands and wives?

    Fourthly, the oneness of Father and Son is one of the most precious relational truths of my faith, and that is exactly what I want to talk about with others, Ditchu.

    This is far, far, far beyond any male/female relationship. Doesn’t Father/Son/Spirit (a triad, not a duo) completely and majestically engulf all creaturely relationships? Nothin’ secret about it. Utterly unique . . . utterly holy . . . eternal love.

    (Sidenote – If the LDS apostles don’t want to bear the offense, what kind of faith is it? communication about and to a father every conference, and never about and to the mother)

    I don’t know if I will really get the LDS scenario on this D, until the LDS authorities began to talk more frankly.

  5. Seth, I am just wondering why LDS father never had the unction to put mother in the BoM. Did he?

    Are you not eager for new doctrine on this, Reggie? Biblical scholars are excited to expose the scriptural coverup in America. Are LDS authorities?

  6. “Seth, I am just wondering why LDS father never had the unction to put mother in the BoM. Did he?”

    The Nephite authors appear to have been even more sexist than the Bible authors. They don’t even mention women if they can help it. The only time women are even mentioned is Sariah (where the people in question were not far removed from the parent Jewish culture) and then Lamanite women. Lamanites apparently held their women in higher esteem than the Nephites did. I doubt the major authors of the Book of Mormon were, frankly, interested in giving women a place in their theology at all.

    Ask and ye shall receive. If God’s people ask not, they will receive not. And honestly, I think that’s what this whole Mother in Heaven problem boils down to – we aren’t asking about her and God is not going to force the issue.

  7. The problem is Todd, you are approaching this whole issue from an assumption of Biblical sufficiency. For you, everything we’ll ever need is supposed to be in the Bible.

    But if you are trying to find out the Mormon view, you will have to think outside the box a bit. We do not consider scripture sufficient. We never have. Our theology, our canon, and our scripture has always been a work in progress.

    That doesn’t bother us. For me, the fact that Mother is absent from scripture is not reason to question God’s character in the slightest. It just means His children are not willing to accept that truth, and He will not force doctrine where it is not wanted or asked for (not always, anyway). Scripture, Church, religion is ALWAYS an interface between the divine and the mortal. Flaws are to be expected in such a scheme.

    For a sola scriptura guy like yourself, the absence of a key doctrine from the canon, no doubt, is highly disturbing. But it doesn’t bug me in the slightest, for the simple fact that we’re not done yet.

    The book is not closed Todd.

  8. Todd,
    I do not understand if you are seeking understanding, why are you so quick to polerize the issue? This is a very sensitive subject and I am doing the best I can to explain what I know. As I am not a general Authority in the LDS Church I cannot say exactly what God does or does not tell his chosen Leaders. What I do know is that I happen to agree that there is more to God than what is hinted to in the Bible. I see it like this: God is real, and we have some stats of his but the the entire story. It is like looking at a Baseball card, we can see some things about the player but we cannot tell what hobbies he may have or what he regurally eats for breakfast, most often we cannot tell if he is married or who he is married to. O.k?

    As for a Heavenly Mother, most of us do not have memory of our Her due to a loss of memory of our pre-earthly life.

    I will tell you from first hand experience, I know we have a Heavenly Mother. I will not go into further detail due to the sacredness of my experience and the riticule that would surely follow by people who will not accept it.

    As to the parts of this Blog that pick at the LDS people I can only say this, you must have a poor view of other peoples beleifs, I say this because you provide much in the way of opinion and hidden slights, but there is every once in a while a clue that you are seeking truth and I would encourage you to continue to seek out truth and be honest in your quest for it. You may someday be surprised where you end up finding truth, I know I have been.

    God bless you on this quest and may you find the journey enlighting,

  9. Todd,
    Are you married?

    If you are, I like you to be honest in a test.
    What people do you speak to about your wife?

    What things do you say about your wife to these people?

    Do you talk about the beauty, the goodness, and the things you cherrish about your wife to these people?

    What about a guy who you can find at a Bar any evening of the week that speaks poorly of you, would you tell that peoson about the greatness of your wife?

    I would doubt that you would if you truly love your wife. I do not speak about my wife to anyone that does not respect me out of understanding that if I did they will disrespect her. I can take junk said about me but talk about my wife and I could be pushed over the line.
    In the same respect our heavenly Father does not want us disrespecting our heavenly Mother. Can you understand that?


  10. ditchu’s view is common in the Church, and I won’t argue much with it.

    I will simply state that I don’t share that view. I think it’s just because we don’t want to know about Mother. Therefore God is constrained in what He can impose upon us.

  11. It’s not about what we want to know. From my observations God reveals those things that are relevant to our eternal salvation; things about how we are to live here in mortality. Far be it from me to demand more be revealed than God judges necessary. I’ll leave that in the hands of our all knowing and all loving Father.

  12. reggie,

    That is not the lesson I take away from the Brother of Jared’s experience. If you have enough faith, God WILL NOT withhold. If we lack knowledge, it is because we lack the faith.

    It’s that simple.

  13. And, for the record, I have heard of people receiving a personal witness of Heavenly Mother. What form that witness took, I do not know. But I believe that witness is available for the asking.

  14. Seth,
    What is being asked for here (as far as I understand it) is for a revelation to the world or at least the masses about our Heavenly Mother. As i have expressed and agree with other views said so far is that the world is not ready for such a revelation.


  15. Seth,

    ditchu is correct, Todd is asking about revelations from church leaders to the entire church or the entire world. It’s true that there is certainly more than could be received, but we have enough to keep us on the correct path today.

    Anytime we get this far away from the central doctrines, as outlined in the articles of faith, the discussions are less than useful.

  16. Hi Todd — “what if” the LDS leaders were to give this kind of revelation to the world?? Would it be treated any differently than the other revelations the Lord has given through them?? I believe the answer is a firm “no”.

    The point being that until a person is ready and willing to accept and cherish what has been given, he won’t be given more. A common phrase in the church is “where much is given, much is required” — I believe a loving Heavenly Father is willing to increase our knowledge and understanding, but there is a price. He loves us too much and will not give us more than we can bear.

  17. Reggie, you mentioned an “all knowing” Father (#11). You don’t follow the progressive “open theism” of some biblical scholars? Secondly, (#15) you believe in sufficiency of scriptures for today’s needs?


    Rob, the world is at emnity with everything that I fundamentally believe and cherish.

  18. Rob said it best.


    I’m not saying we don’t need more revelation, just that we have been receiving that which we need and can bear and we will continue to do so. But it is not up to us which doctrines Heavenly Father decides we (as the whole) need. Overall major doctrinal revelations are not that common. Mostly we’re given help for how to apply or follow revealed doctrine in an ever changing world.

  19. Ah, already revealed doctrine is living, powerful, and sufficient for an ever changing world.

    In fact, the Word sets the world on fire.

    May the word of the Lord run through the corridor and be glorified (2 Thess. 3:1).

  20. “But it is not up to us which doctrines Heavenly Father decides we (as the whole) need.”

    Actually, I think it partially is.

  21. Todd,

    Where does this emnity come from? The influence of Satan is rampant in the world. Creating confusion, contention, and distractions. But this is part of the test. Those who are willing to seek out the greater light and overcome these mists of darkness will be given the greater understanding and knowledge. It is available to everyone that is willing to knock and ask.

    The sadness is when people come in contact with gospel truths and receive a witness of them, but fail to act on them and turn away. They are unwilling to give up their own finite understanding and the wisdom of the world and gain the greatest gift of eternal life (i.e. Mark 10:22).

  22. The world is ever changing?
    Maybe so, but God remains constant, he has not changed from the creation according to Judeo-Christian Beleif.

    Is this world the impornt thing in consideration to religious docturne and revelation that extends beyond the mortal coil? I think you may be too attached to this world to accept any further information about the next existance.

    Maybe that is the hang-up here. If you don’t want to accept the answers then why ask the questions? If you want more from God about this then I suggest you ernestly seek him out and ask, but be prepaired to accept the answer he gives even if it is not what you think it will be.


  23. Seth,

    I assume you mean we can work on being worthy and ready to receive more. Is that correct? I certainly am more interested in letting Heavenly Father tell me what I need, rather than decide for myself.

  24. If you happen to have a Book of Mormon — the 28th chapter of 2nd Nephi comes to mind…specifically verses 30-32. (if not, here’s a link: http://scriptures.lds.org/en/2_ne/28/30)

    In addition, Chapter 29 talks about the attitude that will exist among many of the world who are not willing to accept that there is more truth that what they already think they have.

  25. Yes, that is correct. But there is nothing wrong with praying for information on which you are concerned – both for yourself, and for the Church.

  26. We are commanded to “be one”. God is One with his wife(s), so whenever we see the word, “God” we are to assume we know what it means.

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